 <?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Tim Tebow, Abortion, and the Gospel.</title>
	<atom:link href="http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/</link>
	<description>Ben and Jacqueline Meredith</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Mon, 07 May 2012 14:39:26 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-43</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 17:43:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-43</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the comment, Melissa.  

I agree with those that say a woman has a right to do what she wants with her own body.  I disagree that a being with a distinct heartbeat is &quot;her own body.&quot;  She has no right to stop that little heart from beating.  And anyone who thinks it&#039;s not a distinct life has never seen an ultrasound.  A Christian that is ok with that &quot;choice&quot; needs to repent.  

I also agree with you on the issue of defining Christianity by a political persuasion.  Where you and I might disagree is that I define Christianity by surrender to a real Jesus, as revealed in a living Bible.  Without an authoritative, divinely inspired Bible, Christianity becomes too nebulous a concept to defend.  But we&#039;ve been down that road before, haven&#039;t we, Melissa? :) 

Thanks again for the comment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the comment, Melissa.  </p>
<p>I agree with those that say a woman has a right to do what she wants with her own body.  I disagree that a being with a distinct heartbeat is &#8220;her own body.&#8221;  She has no right to stop that little heart from beating.  And anyone who thinks it&#8217;s not a distinct life has never seen an ultrasound.  A Christian that is ok with that &#8220;choice&#8221; needs to repent.  </p>
<p>I also agree with you on the issue of defining Christianity by a political persuasion.  Where you and I might disagree is that I define Christianity by surrender to a real Jesus, as revealed in a living Bible.  Without an authoritative, divinely inspired Bible, Christianity becomes too nebulous a concept to defend.  But we&#8217;ve been down that road before, haven&#8217;t we, Melissa? <img src='http://benandjacq.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />  </p>
<p>Thanks again for the comment.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Melissa</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-42</link>
		<dc:creator>Melissa</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 17:00:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-42</guid>
		<description>I think addressing this issue in a non-reactionist, thoughtful way is important.

The issue that was brought to my attention from all of this was less the fact that CBS agreed to run the FOTF ad, but also that they declined to air an ad for an LGBTQ dating website. 

I&#039;ll go ahead and be clear as well: I don&#039;t like Focus on the Family, but I am unrelentingly pro-life (which includes anti-death penalty). 

However, my pro-choice clergy and seminarian friends are not pro-abortion, as the article you cited might imply. I don&#039;t think I know a single pro-choice Christian who is pro-abortion. They just value a woman&#039;s right to choose what she does with her body, as do I.

Overturning Roe v. Wade isn&#039;t going to keep people from having abortions. I think you&#039;re right in that it&#039;s a heart-matter. As are many/most of the aspects of living out the gospel.

I shouldn&#039;t feed the hungry, sponsor a child in Africa, or open the door for someone because it&#039;s been legislated. I should do it because my heart is so full of God&#039;s love that it can&#039;t help but pour out in that way.

If the Church acted like the Church, Christians wouldn&#039;t have to be involved in politics. If we were less concerned about &quot;saving the lost&quot; and more concerned about &quot;feeding and housing and caring for the guy down the street,&quot; and we stopped calling people &quot;lost&quot; and just saw them as people on the same difficult journey we&#039;re all on TOGETHER, these issues would begin to be less political and become more heart-centered.

To me, it&#039;s about seeing the interconnectedness of the world, and that connection includes the unborn.

To others, however, being a Christian is about toeing a party line. We are now required to judge someone&#039;s &quot;Christian-ness&quot; by their political stance. And to me, that&#039;s missing the point.
.-= Melissa´s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://revcooper.wordpress.com/2010/02/04/heresy/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Heresy!&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think addressing this issue in a non-reactionist, thoughtful way is important.</p>
<p>The issue that was brought to my attention from all of this was less the fact that CBS agreed to run the FOTF ad, but also that they declined to air an ad for an LGBTQ dating website. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ll go ahead and be clear as well: I don&#8217;t like Focus on the Family, but I am unrelentingly pro-life (which includes anti-death penalty). </p>
<p>However, my pro-choice clergy and seminarian friends are not pro-abortion, as the article you cited might imply. I don&#8217;t think I know a single pro-choice Christian who is pro-abortion. They just value a woman&#8217;s right to choose what she does with her body, as do I.</p>
<p>Overturning Roe v. Wade isn&#8217;t going to keep people from having abortions. I think you&#8217;re right in that it&#8217;s a heart-matter. As are many/most of the aspects of living out the gospel.</p>
<p>I shouldn&#8217;t feed the hungry, sponsor a child in Africa, or open the door for someone because it&#8217;s been legislated. I should do it because my heart is so full of God&#8217;s love that it can&#8217;t help but pour out in that way.</p>
<p>If the Church acted like the Church, Christians wouldn&#8217;t have to be involved in politics. If we were less concerned about &#8220;saving the lost&#8221; and more concerned about &#8220;feeding and housing and caring for the guy down the street,&#8221; and we stopped calling people &#8220;lost&#8221; and just saw them as people on the same difficult journey we&#8217;re all on TOGETHER, these issues would begin to be less political and become more heart-centered.</p>
<p>To me, it&#8217;s about seeing the interconnectedness of the world, and that connection includes the unborn.</p>
<p>To others, however, being a Christian is about toeing a party line. We are now required to judge someone&#8217;s &#8220;Christian-ness&#8221; by their political stance. And to me, that&#8217;s missing the point.<br />
.-= Melissa´s last blog ..<a href="http://revcooper.wordpress.com/2010/02/04/heresy/" rel="nofollow">Heresy!</a> =-.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Craig Pitman</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-39</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig Pitman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 16:41:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-39</guid>
		<description>Zac, maybe you are privy to information that I am not, but I don&#039;t think it is quite fair to say that Focus doesn&#039;t spend anytime on families after a baby is born. I know from Dr. Dobson&#039;s books that they give much attention to all aspects of family life.  The fact that perhaps the spotlight is on the issues of abortion and gay marriage is that they see (and I think correctly) that these two issues are a direct assault upon the institution of the family and ultimately a direct assault upon God Himself. Martin Luther&#039;s words here bear our remembrance, &lt;blockquote cite&gt;If I profess with loudest voice and clearest exposition every portion of the truth of God except that little point which the world and the Devil are at that moment attacking, I am not confessing Christ, however boldly I may be professing Christ. Where the battle rages, there the loyalty of the soldier is proved, and to be steady on all the battlefield besides, is mere flight and disgrace if he flinches at that point.&lt;/blockquote&gt; It is true that laws cannot change the hearts of men, but it is also true that one of the purposes of law is to restrain evil, and to that end we should be doing all we can to peacefully and prophetically declare God&#039;s Word to student and leader and pray that God&#039;s Spirit would bring about Gospel righteousness in the heart and in our laws.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Zac, maybe you are privy to information that I am not, but I don&#8217;t think it is quite fair to say that Focus doesn&#8217;t spend anytime on families after a baby is born. I know from Dr. Dobson&#8217;s books that they give much attention to all aspects of family life.  The fact that perhaps the spotlight is on the issues of abortion and gay marriage is that they see (and I think correctly) that these two issues are a direct assault upon the institution of the family and ultimately a direct assault upon God Himself. Martin Luther&#8217;s words here bear our remembrance,<br />
<blockquote cite>If I profess with loudest voice and clearest exposition every portion of the truth of God except that little point which the world and the Devil are at that moment attacking, I am not confessing Christ, however boldly I may be professing Christ. Where the battle rages, there the loyalty of the soldier is proved, and to be steady on all the battlefield besides, is mere flight and disgrace if he flinches at that point.</p></blockquote>
<p> It is true that laws cannot change the hearts of men, but it is also true that one of the purposes of law is to restrain evil, and to that end we should be doing all we can to peacefully and prophetically declare God&#8217;s Word to student and leader and pray that God&#8217;s Spirit would bring about Gospel righteousness in the heart and in our laws.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-41</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 15:50:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-41</guid>
		<description>fixed your html!  Thanks also for your additional input, Craig.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>fixed your html!  Thanks also for your additional input, Craig.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Zac</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-37</link>
		<dc:creator>Zac</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 13:17:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-37</guid>
		<description>Thank you for saying this. I think a lot of Christians spend way too much time arguing their cause and think that if all of a sudden Roe v. Wade was overturned that would be the end of abortion. The result would just be a whole lot more back alley abortion clinics. Like Ben said, making something illegal won&#039;t change people&#039;s desires (see: Weed, Speeding, etc.).

I think if there is one thing that Christians need to realize is that no matter what they do, or who they vote for, this issue isn&#039;t going to be solved until Jesus returns.  It is obvious to us that abortion is horrible, but just like gay marriage, your beliefs cannot be forced down someones throat. Otherwise they will hate your beliefs. 

If Focus on the Family spent any time focusing on families after the baby was born (i.e. single mothers, the extremely poor, the starving, etc.) then I would say this wasn&#039;t just a political commercial. Unfortunately, they focus on two issues and both line up with their political candidates, but other issues that involve the family such as welfare and the like they stay away from because the political party they align themself with is against that. 

I think that if you want to reach the lost, you need to approach them with love and make them curious of why you are able to keep smiling despite the world falling apart around them. There just doesn&#039;t seem to be any love when it comes to the strong divide that surrounds this issue. Forcing someone to believe what you believe strengthens their resolve to reject you or that belief.

Sorry if I offend anyone with all that, but I just think that caring for the lesser of these: the sick, the poor, the imprisioned, the homeless, etc. is far more important than getting political. Give to Ceaser what is Ceaser&#039;s and give to God what is God&#039;s.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thank you for saying this. I think a lot of Christians spend way too much time arguing their cause and think that if all of a sudden Roe v. Wade was overturned that would be the end of abortion. The result would just be a whole lot more back alley abortion clinics. Like Ben said, making something illegal won&#8217;t change people&#8217;s desires (see: Weed, Speeding, etc.).</p>
<p>I think if there is one thing that Christians need to realize is that no matter what they do, or who they vote for, this issue isn&#8217;t going to be solved until Jesus returns.  It is obvious to us that abortion is horrible, but just like gay marriage, your beliefs cannot be forced down someones throat. Otherwise they will hate your beliefs. </p>
<p>If Focus on the Family spent any time focusing on families after the baby was born (i.e. single mothers, the extremely poor, the starving, etc.) then I would say this wasn&#8217;t just a political commercial. Unfortunately, they focus on two issues and both line up with their political candidates, but other issues that involve the family such as welfare and the like they stay away from because the political party they align themself with is against that. </p>
<p>I think that if you want to reach the lost, you need to approach them with love and make them curious of why you are able to keep smiling despite the world falling apart around them. There just doesn&#8217;t seem to be any love when it comes to the strong divide that surrounds this issue. Forcing someone to believe what you believe strengthens their resolve to reject you or that belief.</p>
<p>Sorry if I offend anyone with all that, but I just think that caring for the lesser of these: the sick, the poor, the imprisioned, the homeless, etc. is far more important than getting political. Give to Ceaser what is Ceaser&#8217;s and give to God what is God&#8217;s.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ben</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-36</link>
		<dc:creator>Ben</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 04 Feb 2010 00:15:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-36</guid>
		<description>I am going to stand by that line.  To clarify, I didn&#039;t call laws useless.  But I&#039;d say Galatians and Romans make clear that the law only shows us our need for heart-change.  Also, there should be a distinction, in my mind, between God&#039;s law and governmental regulation.  Uncle Sam&#039;s law is especially non-transformative.  
That God can and does use the law as a catalyst to heart-change is undeniable.  But for the Supreme Court to overturn Roe wouldn&#039;t change any hearts.  That was and is my point.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am going to stand by that line.  To clarify, I didn&#8217;t call laws useless.  But I&#8217;d say Galatians and Romans make clear that the law only shows us our need for heart-change.  Also, there should be a distinction, in my mind, between God&#8217;s law and governmental regulation.  Uncle Sam&#8217;s law is especially non-transformative.<br />
That God can and does use the law as a catalyst to heart-change is undeniable.  But for the Supreme Court to overturn Roe wouldn&#8217;t change any hearts.  That was and is my point.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ken Summerlin</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-35</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken Summerlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 21:35:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-35</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m with Ben on this one.  If the purpose of the law was not to justify us with God but to point us to the need for a savior, is not every moral issue really an issue of changing our hearts toward God and His righteousness?  Governmental law may restrict my behavior but that law is not likely to change my heart regarding that issue.  Maybe it&#039;s not an &quot;either/or&quot; question as much as it&#039;s a &quot;and&quot; question.  Focusing only on enacting law will never bring us lasting change.
.-= Ken Summerlin´s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.kenwords.com/2010/02/funny-thing-happened-on-way-to-lunch.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;A funny thing happened on the way to lunch  . . .&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m with Ben on this one.  If the purpose of the law was not to justify us with God but to point us to the need for a savior, is not every moral issue really an issue of changing our hearts toward God and His righteousness?  Governmental law may restrict my behavior but that law is not likely to change my heart regarding that issue.  Maybe it&#8217;s not an &#8220;either/or&#8221; question as much as it&#8217;s a &#8220;and&#8221; question.  Focusing only on enacting law will never bring us lasting change.<br />
.-= Ken Summerlin´s last blog ..<a href="http://www.kenwords.com/2010/02/funny-thing-happened-on-way-to-lunch.html" rel="nofollow">A funny thing happened on the way to lunch  . . .</a> =-.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Alicia</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-34</link>
		<dc:creator>Alicia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 20:41:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-34</guid>
		<description>&quot;There&#039;s almost no fact more biblically true than &#039;laws don&#039;t change hearts&#039;&quot;?

Really? Deut. 4 and Ps. 119 seem to offer a different view. 

Is it possible to conform to the requirements of the law while hating the law? Of course. But it seems God intended Isreal&#039;s law to transform the world. And the Psalmist delights in the transformative power of the law in Psalm 119. 

It&#039;s great to desire that lost people encounter and be changed by the Gospel. But I don&#039;t really understand downplaying the importance of legislative reform. This is just as essential. Nations can be judged by the laws they implement, and Roe v. Wade is the most atrocious of all our laws.
.-= Alicia´s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://theoldmill.wordpress.com/2010/01/31/inserting-a-where-jesus-put-an/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Inserting a ? where Jesus put an !&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;There&#8217;s almost no fact more biblically true than &#8216;laws don&#8217;t change hearts&#8217;&#8221;?</p>
<p>Really? Deut. 4 and Ps. 119 seem to offer a different view. </p>
<p>Is it possible to conform to the requirements of the law while hating the law? Of course. But it seems God intended Isreal&#8217;s law to transform the world. And the Psalmist delights in the transformative power of the law in Psalm 119. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s great to desire that lost people encounter and be changed by the Gospel. But I don&#8217;t really understand downplaying the importance of legislative reform. This is just as essential. Nations can be judged by the laws they implement, and Roe v. Wade is the most atrocious of all our laws.<br />
.-= Alicia´s last blog ..<a href="http://theoldmill.wordpress.com/2010/01/31/inserting-a-where-jesus-put-an/" rel="nofollow">Inserting a ? where Jesus put an !</a> =-.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Craig Pitman</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-33</link>
		<dc:creator>Craig Pitman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 17:47:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-33</guid>
		<description>Good comment Ben. I am hoping (and from what I hear, this is the case) that the ad is simply an account of a family who, when faced with a crisis, affirmed life. Abortion would never have become an acceptable practice in our country if people had not first abandoned the conviction that all children are a blessing. It is a philosophical small step to go from viewing children as impediments to one&#039;s career and life-style to disposable masses of tissue. Had family and children been held in Biblically high regard in our culture, Roe would never have passed. So I maintain that even if Roe is ever overturned, nothing will really change until (as you pointed out) the hearts of the people  (and leaders) change in regard to the value of family and children. It is no small comfort that Malachi promises that one of the benefits of the Gospel is that the &quot;hearts of the fathers will be turned to their children and the hearts of the children to their fathers.&quot; 

As for the ad. The &quot;Pro-Aborts&quot; (and their shrillness is exposing them as just that) are claiming that the Super Bowl is not the proper forum for the ad. I even heard someone suggest it be shown during the Oscars or Grammys instead. Come on now, Tim Tebow is a football player so the Super Bowl is much more of an appropriate forum to show the ad than any other televised event; at least that&#039;s my two shekels worth.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good comment Ben. I am hoping (and from what I hear, this is the case) that the ad is simply an account of a family who, when faced with a crisis, affirmed life. Abortion would never have become an acceptable practice in our country if people had not first abandoned the conviction that all children are a blessing. It is a philosophical small step to go from viewing children as impediments to one&#8217;s career and life-style to disposable masses of tissue. Had family and children been held in Biblically high regard in our culture, Roe would never have passed. So I maintain that even if Roe is ever overturned, nothing will really change until (as you pointed out) the hearts of the people  (and leaders) change in regard to the value of family and children. It is no small comfort that Malachi promises that one of the benefits of the Gospel is that the &#8220;hearts of the fathers will be turned to their children and the hearts of the children to their fathers.&#8221; </p>
<p>As for the ad. The &#8220;Pro-Aborts&#8221; (and their shrillness is exposing them as just that) are claiming that the Super Bowl is not the proper forum for the ad. I even heard someone suggest it be shown during the Oscars or Grammys instead. Come on now, Tim Tebow is a football player so the Super Bowl is much more of an appropriate forum to show the ad than any other televised event; at least that&#8217;s my two shekels worth.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ken Summerlin</title>
		<link>http://benandjacq.com/2010/02/tim-tebow-abortion-and-the-gospel/comment-page-1/#comment-32</link>
		<dc:creator>Ken Summerlin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 03 Feb 2010 17:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://benandjacq.com/?p=347010239#comment-32</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m pretty sure that at the end of my earthly life that the first question that my Heavenly Father is going is ask me is NOT, &quot;Were you pro-choice or pro-life?&quot;  I think he&#039;s going to ask me, &quot;What did you do with My Son?&quot;  While my answer to that question may determine my position on the abortion issue, as Christians, I think we need to stop trying to make everything about this one issue.  I respect the right of FOF and the Tebows to air an ad on this topic and I, too,  hope that their focus is the actual issue and not  simply on legislating how our country will address it.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.
.-= Ken Summerlin´s last blog ..&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.kenwords.com/2010/02/funny-thing-happened-on-way-to-lunch.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;A funny thing happened on the way to lunch  . . .&lt;/a&gt; =-.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m pretty sure that at the end of my earthly life that the first question that my Heavenly Father is going is ask me is NOT, &#8220;Were you pro-choice or pro-life?&#8221;  I think he&#8217;s going to ask me, &#8220;What did you do with My Son?&#8221;  While my answer to that question may determine my position on the abortion issue, as Christians, I think we need to stop trying to make everything about this one issue.  I respect the right of FOF and the Tebows to air an ad on this topic and I, too,  hope that their focus is the actual issue and not  simply on legislating how our country will address it.</p>
<p>Thanks for sharing your thoughts on this.<br />
.-= Ken Summerlin´s last blog ..<a href="http://www.kenwords.com/2010/02/funny-thing-happened-on-way-to-lunch.html" rel="nofollow">A funny thing happened on the way to lunch  . . .</a> =-.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

